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Fury as SFA backs Team GB for Olympics

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Published Date: 30 May 2009
THE Scottish Football Association faced a furious backlash from supporters yesterday after consenting to a plan that could allow a team to compete on behalf of Britain at the London Olympics in 2012.
The Tartan Army said it was "shocked and disgusted" that the SFA had abandoned its outright hostility to a "Team GB" football entry, while an SNP MSP broke party ranks to demand the resignation of association chief executive Gordon Smith.

Fans fea
r that the formation of a Great Britain team – even one that would be made up only of English players – will threaten the ability of the four home nations to compete independently in the World Cup and European Championships.

The SFA yesterday admitted it had held secret talks with its counterparts in England, Wales and Northern Ireland after being asked by FIFA, the world governing body for football, to "find a common solution" to the formation of a combined team for the 2012 Games.

The British Olympic Association is determined to enter a team because the Olympics are being held in London and has the backing of Prime Minister Gordon Brown. The SFA said it and the Northern Irish and Welsh football associations "completely opposed" the idea.

The SFA statement said: "However, we acknowledge that the English FA do wish to have an involvement in the 2012 Olympic football tournament as it is being held in their country. A proposal has therefore gone forward to Fifa which states that England will field a team in the 2012 Olympics made up exclusively of English players. Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland will not play any part."

The Association of Tartan Army Clubs plans to call a meeting in Newcastle next month of all "real football fans" from the home nations in an effort to block any team playing under the Team GB banner. Spokesman Tam Ferry said: "We are shocked and disgusted with this U-turn and apparent endorsement of a Team GB."

He said the associations' decision to remove their opposition and allow England to play as Team GB set a dangerous precedent which could "lead to the end of our identities as independent international football nations".

"The four FAs clearly fail to realise that this decision could end up costing them their positions and could be the beginning of the end of the Scottish, English, Wales and Irish FAs," he said.

Barry Robson, the Celtic and Scotland midfielder, said the team should not be called Team GB if it only contained English players. "It's not going to be a Team GB if Scotland aren't in it," he said.

The SNP claimed that "fans across the country would be cheering the move".

But Christine Grahame, an SNP MSP and chairman of the Scottish Parliament's health and sport committee, called for Mr Smith to "do the honourable thing" and resign, or be sacked.

In remarks that an SNP spokesman emphasised were a personal view, Ms Grahame said a Team GB football team threatened Scottish football and the Scottish economy.

"A GB football team competing at the London 2012 Olympics poses a direct threat to the future of the Scotland international side and the Scottish league set-up," she said.





The full article contains 539 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 29 May 2009 9:41 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: London Olympics 2012
 
1

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29/05/2009 22:23:59
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29/05/2009 22:31:09
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29/05/2009 22:35:41
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Backofthenet,

30/05/2009 00:06:45
There was always going to be a "GB" team in some form. I don't see how the English FA can be prevented from entering a team. The best the other three associations can do is to stay out of it.
5

Vivas,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 00:08:09
I think its brilliant. Maybe it will help some Scots to understand how things work in (ahem) "Great Britain".

- The next Conservative UK government will be imposed on Scotland by an English majority.
- A GB football team will will be imposed on Scotland by an all English first eleven.

Do you get it Scotland ? Are you at long last starting to see how this works ?
6

Brianwci,

30/05/2009 00:11:33
Of course, there is one solid way of making sure there is always a Scottish team in International Competitions.....


It's called INDEPENDENCE
7

Alan B,

30/05/2009 00:17:32
Seems like it would be best to have a scottish olympic team. Then none of this would arise.

Can't see why football should part of the olympic though.
8

Scotty F,

The Borders 30/05/2009 00:23:34
I find it sad that politicians from all sides have to get involved in this, and Christine Grahams comments are just a mark of how out of touch the tweedy crow actually is. The independance of all home nations must be guaranteed by Fifa if this ever is to get off the ground, make it a one off say as its in the UK. Its just an argument ripe for the picking in the age old Union debate. Look at the British and Irish Lions in the rugby, no hassel at all, the example has been set. If football in this country chooses to follow suit then so be it. But at the end of the day its about the sport and politicians should keep their noses out, particularly Christine Graham another case of her trying to get in the papers, the next thing we will know she will be chating to Kim Jong-Il!!!!
9

Tris,

30/05/2009 00:47:20
Brown hates Scotland doesn't he? He so ashamed to come from Scotland that he calls it North Britian.

Says all you need to know.

Bad move though electorally, I would think. Plenty of people who have no interest in political independence, who don't even care that half his ministers are on the fiddle over taxes, but who have a great deal of interest in football independence.

Sill Gordy
10

Nevsky;,

Moscow 30/05/2009 01:14:53
Rufus dnounces 90% of the Scotttish, Welsh and Northern Irish supporters but such right up to the English...what a surprise...sycophnatic creep!
11

Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 01:22:48
re17

Says it all really! What he also misses is that the majority of English supporters did not want a team GB either - a fact that must only make him choke? Or is it his masters phallus that is making him gagg?
12

Ewan Randall,

30/05/2009 01:29:39
Is it not right that we had originally said we would not field any of our players in a GB team in the Olympics?

Is it not also right we said the English FA could do what they wanted in regards to fielding players in a GB team?

Then isn't our own Scottish FA actually carrying out those things which had already been cleared, when telling the English to go a head without them?
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30/05/2009 01:45:12
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tartangladbach,

edinburgh 30/05/2009 01:59:47
well done! a decision formed in downing street and carried out in the true olympic spirt! alienate people all over the UK? i thought the olympics was about pulling people together? or is london 2012 another political gravy train waiting to derail?
15

Ewan Randall,

30/05/2009 02:06:31
(#22) – (tartangladbach) – Didn’t all of the none English Football Associations pull together when they stated they wished to have nothing to do with fielding their players in a GB strip at the Olympics?
16

Edward,

30/05/2009 02:10:38
Im hoping that by 2012, it will not matter as by then, Scotland would have returned 30 to 40 SNP MP's to Westminster in the general election in 2010, We have had the referendum in 2010 and chosen indpendence and SNP sweep to a landslide in Holyrood in 2011
Can live in hope! I certainly will not be supporting any fabricated 'team GB', if they somehow play in Scotand!
17

Canada,

Canada 30/05/2009 02:23:34
Such problems arise when a nation continues to be an underling and takes direction from a foreign government. Grow up Scotland, take responsibility as an adult for your own affairs. Stop being a quissling. Take control. It is called Independence. Like being a grown up adult.
18

Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 02:36:14
RE24

To be fair to Broonie he treats the Scots, Welsh, Northern Irish and the English with contempt. At least those of them who will not join is pet GB project that is! Och I forgtot he treats anyone who is not a Brit with contempt being such a superior being who has saved the world from destruction.

Dont forget English Football Supporters dont want Team GB either. Their FA wss bribed by Labour who agreed to divert huge resources into building the New Wembley! A nice little earner for some that one! The corporate suits will roll into Wembley tomorrow and outnumber the combined support of Chelsea and Everton supporters.

The English dont want Team Grubby Brown anymore than any other football supporter from Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland. Excepting of course those diehard Unionist Little Britisher bigots who wrap themselves in the Union Jack! Even some of them think he has totally lost the plot!
19

W Smith,

Middle East 30/05/2009 03:56:59
So Christine Grahame thinks it will affect the Scottish economy?

Like she's always concerned about the economy.

This is the same woman who was against the George Medal as it was too "anglo-centric".

She tried to get the British Army kicked out of Edinburgh Castle while Salmond was demonstrationg in public with Leftie George Galloway who compared our soldiers to Nazis, and of course we have Mike Weir who has decided James McLintock has done no wrong.

In my opnion, the SNP is a disgrace and its run by 79 Group type anti-British left wing extemists.

Somewhere lurking in the background is that other woman Sandra White who is now involved with the Palestinians (Free Gaza Campaign) and who refers to the Union Jack as the "Butchers Apron".

BTW
Christine Grahame should be asking MacAskill to resign, not Gordon Smith.

The fact that the SNP think football is more important than a murder escaping from the "skoosh" prisons tells us all we have to know about the SNP and its leadersip.
20

Nevsky;,

Moscow 30/05/2009 04:22:51
29 Smith*

Lots of people refer to the Jack as the 'butchers apron' which is what it has been...more blood staining that rag than any other as far as i know.

What's your problem with MacAskill...he is doing a great job...5 times better than Labour and 8 times better than the Tories.

Just face it....your beliefs are going down the tubes....wave bye bye Labour in Scotland and wave bye bye the union...and no more butchers apron!
21

The Pict.,

Canada/Edinburgh 30/05/2009 04:26:18
Disregarding W. Smith the Israeli who has nothing to say about Scotland.
Gordon Smith should be fired out on his Donkey. # 5 vivas is absolutely correct. All of us true Scotsmen/women know exactly what's going on. The problem can and will be solved. It's called INDEPENDENCE. How obtained ? Easy / simple VOTE S.N.P. the SCOTTISH PARTY.
Slainte Mhath.
22

redcliffe62,

30/05/2009 05:17:26
we do not know what was agreed behind closed doors with fifa. but whatever it was satisfied the celtic f.a group.
gordon smith should announce that they will play in england strips as england, as the term GB will not go down well at all.
i am sure this has been considered. and agreed. but clarification will be helpful. immediately.
if it is not then do not be surprised to see a token cel cajoled in who decides that it is no big deal that he should override the country that he previously chose to represent.
it is imperative for cyclops it is seen as team GB, if it is seen as team "england" officially then the questions arise as to why england cannot do other sports separately as well at the olympics, and where would that end, independence?
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30/05/2009 05:26:12
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30/05/2009 05:32:26
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30/05/2009 05:33:25
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30/05/2009 06:09:52
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Bardas,

Aberystwyth 30/05/2009 06:19:36

It seems to me that the reason for the knee-jerk nationlist anti-English diatribe within these comments is based on a refusal to acknowledge that the Scottish Leagues are hardly worthy of international representation, and some folk are desparate to hide that fact from the world. Bad news, guys..we already know. Now okay, you want your ball back, now please go and play with it. We`ll just get on with our games in 2012, okay? So let us geton with it..sheesh, and I`m Welsh, just get over it will you....
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30/05/2009 06:46:05
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westcider,

Isle of Lewis 30/05/2009 06:52:42
#25 Edward.
30 SNP MP's in the general election of 2010 would be a mandate for Independence, that's correct.
30

donald,

glasgow 30/05/2009 06:59:01
The SFA traditionally blocked a Scottish Anthem and Scottish flag. It was the fans who howled it down, as they traditionaly opposed an Anglo Team GB. I hope Broon gives the SFA, who traditionally give their Scots fans sweet FA, their knichtiehoods and a residence in London, say Ben Dover Hoose and take the Unionist Old Firm and Dr Death with them.
31

Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 07:14:34
#28 Grupenfurher Smith,

The union jack IS the Butcher's Apron.

VOTE SNP
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30/05/2009 07:17:16
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Linda,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 07:20:00
Smith and SFA has been bought and sold by English gold with the promise of a money making game at Hampden.
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Ross,

Athens 30/05/2009 07:37:09
Let them play in their little tournament, no one really cares about it anyway.

Referendum now please!
35

Mikey,

30/05/2009 07:50:01
Best thing to do would be to turn up at the game and support whoever team England are playing. Simple really.
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30/05/2009 07:51:03
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30/05/2009 07:55:51
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30/05/2009 07:57:21
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Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 07:59:15
When Comrade Broon's humiliation in the EU and council elections is announced, will this paper report the fact or will they still be reprinting New Labour Sleaze press releases???


From The Times,

"The expenses scandal has had a devastating impact on Labour and Gordon Brown, a Populus poll for The Times finds today.

Labour’s overall position has slid to 21 per cent, its lowest in polling history. When asked how they would vote in next week’s European election, those polled have put Labour in third place behind UKIP and the Tories, for the first time."
40

The Tin Man,

30/05/2009 08:00:43
No suck hysteria about the British Lions, or the GB olympic team. Storm in tea-cup created by nit-wits.
41

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30/05/2009 08:01:02
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The Tin Man,

30/05/2009 08:02:06
#48 Jimmy

Vote Jury Team:

http://www.juryteam.org/
43

Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 08:10:04
#51 Tinny,

If I voted for the Tory Jury Team I'd be breaking the law!!

Its only New Labour Sleaze who are into voting fraud.

I've already voted SNP, as I always do.

VOTE SNP
44

Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 08:14:47
Morning Rufus, Fit like today???

The petitions have fallen by the wayside, what with the excitement of the expenses scandal and the forthcoming utter humiliation of Comrade Broon and his cabal of fraudsters, liars, lowlife crooks and swindlers.

Will you be voting Rufus???

How will you be voting Rufus???

Don't waste your vote by voting New Labour Sleaze.

Voting for small minority party's is wasting your vote!!

VOTE SNP
45

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 30/05/2009 08:18:03
#41 Vincent

Either you are unable to comprehend the issue at hand or you are unwilling. Either way, you don't seem to grasp the dangers for Scottish football independence.
46

Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 08:18:16
Looks like Comrade Broon will be kicked out in the next 10 days.

Then we'll get another unelected PM foisted onto us again.

Then we'll wipe out New Labour Sleaze at the GE!!

From The Daily Mail,

"Gordon Brown is heading for humiliation in the European elections as voters desert his party in droves in protest over the expenses scandal, a BPIX poll for The Mail on Sunday has found.

Labour's predicted share of the vote in the June 4 elections has fallen to just 17 per cent - neck and neck with the UK Independence Party (UKIP), which advocates Britain's complete withdrawal from the EU."
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30/05/2009 08:24:53
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30/05/2009 08:26:32
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Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 08:37:11
I hope the new postal voting forms won't inconvenience the Sleaze and Corruption Party too much??

The extra sheet with the signature and DoB required will mean more work for our corrupt comrades.

And all for nothing!!!!

VOTE SNP
50

Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 08:39:09
#60 Danny,

Don't worry about it too much because there won't be a problem when we become independent!

VOTE SNP, the ONLY party for ALL the people of Scotland.
51

Boy Wonder,

30/05/2009 08:40:03
If there are NO Scots, Welsh or Irish players on the team ... and we know there won't be ... then it's NOT a British team. It's Team England!
52

Jimmy Le Pie,

30/05/2009 08:48:19
Just been reading the Telegraph.

Seems Our Dear Leader is considering a coalition with the Libdums!!!

I'm surprised that the Libdums would consider any coalition with such a sleaze ridden, 'small' party, such as New Labour Sleaze!!!

"ne radical idea would be to bring senior Liberal Democrat MPs into Government, the most obvious being Vince Cable. That would involve a series of deals behind the scenes involving Nick Clegg, the Liberal Democrat leader. Last night Labour sources suggested that any such deals were still a long way off.

Labour is expected to struggle badly in Thursday’s elections. A worse than expected result would add to pressure on Mr Brown’s leadership. Last autumn he surprised Westminster by bringing back Peter Mandelson in a reshuffle that helped shore up his position.

He is understood to be considering a similar “game-changing” move this weekend.

Mr Brown knows that he faces a traumatic period in the run-up to the summer recess if, as expected, Labour fares very poorly next week.

Some predict Labour could finish fourth behind the Conservatives, Liberal Democrats and the UK Independence Party. A new poll puts Labour in third place on 16 per cent, behind the Tories on 30 per cent, and Ukip on 19 per cent."
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30/05/2009 08:53:30
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Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 08:57:13
That we should be represented internationally by a GB Team has now been agreed by all four national football associations.
There is nothing more to say.
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30/05/2009 09:00:38
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30/05/2009 09:08:38
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30/05/2009 09:11:24
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30/05/2009 09:12:14
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30/05/2009 09:13:25
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radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:17:12
Doctor Death - how fluent is your Gaelic. You certainly are a drabastair and have been reported as such.

Faodaidh tu mo fhreagairt an-seo ma tha rudeigin cruthachail agad ri radh. Chi sinn...

As to the piece. NO Team GB. Give the English their independence.
62

Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:17:32
74, let's have a discussion and see what happens, shall we?
63

Mèths,

30/05/2009 09:18:07
72

Stop beating about the bush. Say what you mean!
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Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:19:21
#75, chan eil an drabastair, an bleigeard!
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Mèths,

30/05/2009 09:20:19
Our Rufus the doc comes here for a laugh. If you don't like his posts, just skip by them. I read them as they're obviously done for a joke. He couldn't possibly be serious could he?

(The only poster I have stopped reading is Ewan Randall)
66

Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:20:31
#77, :-)
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Fred Leeson,

edinburgh 30/05/2009 09:21:28
Talk about turkeys voting for Christmas. Although it's only the English FA who want this Team GB and only English players will be eligible for selection by sanctioning this deal the other FA's will be signing their own death warrants. For all the bluster about 'compromise' and a 'one off' at the end of the day the whole world will see Team GB as Team England and then think 'hang on why does Team GB get to field 4 teams in World Cups and European Cups ?'
68

radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:21:35
AS to parochial, a German friend of mine wonders why there is so little on English/British telly dealing with Europe. In Germany, European news takes precendence over smaller 'national' issues.

The only news/current affairs program that i can think of which is outward looking in BBC Alba's 'Eorpa'. Funny, how it takes Gaelic speaking Scots to interact positively with our neighbours when much of the English media and public seems to hate them.

It's a bit like Scotland having good trading links with most major European nations and then after the Act of Union, suddenly finding ourselves at war with them.

The whole idea of 'GB' is outdated, imperialist and aggressive. Time for an independent forward looking Scotland.
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radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:22:39
Se drabastair a th'ann an Doctor Death gu cinnteach.
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radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:23:08
Though maybe Dr Death's 'gàidhlig' has deserted him!
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30/05/2009 09:26:41
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Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:29:39
So, you insulting little BNP snide, cojones not big enough? Away and hide behind yer mammy's skirt....
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Fred Leeson,

edinburgh 30/05/2009 09:29:59
#82 radge
I reckon it's a conspiracy to avoid us actually finding out what's happening in Europe. It makes our troughergate very small fry. I didn't realise they got £200K a year ( Farag of UKIP has trousered £2M so far ). They also get £800 for every trip they make to Europe ( classed as a first class air fare ticket- most take Easyjet and trouser the rest )You hear from Euro MP's at election time and that's it. Only 2% of the population could tell you who their Euro MP is. And that's the way they like it.
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30/05/2009 09:31:40
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Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:35:54
#82, I totally agree with you. "British" tv news is totally obsessed with what happens in London to the detriment of every citizen.

I was always amazed how the "Nachrichten" on ZDF always led with international news and how it affected Germany and left local news to the later slots.

You've hit the nail on the head as regards the "union" being outdated. This is one "union" that should have been emasculated long before the "trade" ones!
76

radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:38:59
#88 makes no sense. You're a bit of a fraud aren't you? And a sick one at that.
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30/05/2009 09:39:02
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Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:39:47
#88, been on Google, have you? You've lost! You're discredited! Depart! Moran taing!
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30/05/2009 09:41:18
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radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:43:23
#89 - true, English-based news is so navel-gazing it's embarrassing. I'd love to find out more about the outside world - not just our 'friends' the US - but Europe and other countries where that we don't occupy.

Yeah, Euro MPs are on a gravy train too but how often do we hear positive news from Europe? What about the non-EU countries? Norway for example? Or would Norway give Scots too many ideas about going independent?
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30/05/2009 09:46:32
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radge dug,

30/05/2009 09:47:41
#95, so you're a pervert and thick.
83

Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:53:08
#94, having lived in Germany and Denmark, I can confirm that they are more outward looking than the Brits. Could be that they are more confident about their democracy than we are. Sure, citizens still moan and complain about taxes etc., but they have a multi party democracy where there will always be comeone to listen to their complaints and act on them.

Sure, I wouldn't give house room to some of the parties but they don't have a gang of quislings in power, trying to sell them out at every opportunity!

Don't talk about Norway! The Brit quislings don't like to hear about Norway!
84

Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:54:34
#93 & 95, juvenile, juvenile, juvenile! I've changed my mind. You're not a fascist. You're just a moron.
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30/05/2009 09:56:12
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Buccaneer,

Stirling 30/05/2009 09:58:57
I'm a rugby fan, and this story confirms all my prejudices about the stupidity of football players, fans and associations. Some of these messages show that bigots and racists are thriving. Every other sport manages to sort these things out. Whinge all summer, guys. I'll be sitting down with a pint watching the British and Irish Lions. Yes - Irish - you can be a real country and still play with people born on other spotty lumps of land.
87

Mikey,

30/05/2009 09:59:44
Anyway, I've got a life, so I'm out of here. Radge, been a pleasure talking to you.

Rufus, try and grow up!
88

mr broon,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 10:18:40
In an interview, FIFA President Sebb Blatter expressed his frustration about this matter and stated that the Home Associations were making too much of it.

His answer was simple: an "English, Welsh, OR Youth team" to represent the British Olympic football team which would not endanger the Home Associations unique articles of association with FIFA.

Who cares who represents GB because everyone is well aware it's not real fitba! Anyone who watched the dire quality of so-called national teams that played in the last Olympics knows this to be the case.
89

Nik,

Embra 30/05/2009 10:28:45
Check the 2nd paragraph of this link:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/8073721.stm

BBC at its best, eh?
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30/05/2009 10:35:50
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Darien,

Panama 30/05/2009 10:37:32
#1oo Buccaneer: "you can be a real country and still play with people born on other spotty lumps of land"

Scotland is a "real country". Try telling that to the EU, the UN, the World Bank, FIFA, the Arctic Commission, USA Immigration, etc etc etc. How stupid are you? A "real country" is a country that is recognised by other nations. Scotland is not recognised as a nation by other nations. That is because Scotland is not a nation. Just because your 'country' is recognised by a sporting association does not make it a "real country". You rugby egits sicken me, waving your St. Andrews cross flags at Murrayfield and then voting to be governed by a foreign country. Very patriotic indeed. Scotland a "real country". Get some backbone.

Thankfully the SFA do not speak for the people of Scotland. And the SFA do not represent the people of Scotland. But so long as feeble Scots with no backbone elect to be ruled over by a foreign nation, then we only have ourselves to blame.

"...the associations' decision to remove their opposition and allow England to play as Team GB set a dangerous precedent which could "lead to the end of our identities as independent international football nations"."

There's only one guarantee of maintaining an independent Scottish national team at any sport, and that is through independence. So long as Scotland exists merely as a region of the oddly named 'nation' UKofGB&NI then there is absolutely nothing to stop any international body or association telling Scotland to where to go.

At the moment Scotland is powerless to do anything. It needs real nationhood to ensure any nation can play on the international stage without such threats. Scotland at the present time is not a real nation. To be a real nation requires that the nation is recognised as a nation by other nations. Scotland is not recognised as a nation because in fact it is no more than a region of another nation (i.e. UKofGB&NI).

Scotland's footballing legacy today as a 'nation
92

Darien,

Panama 30/05/2009 10:38:23
Cont............

Scotland's footballing legacy today as a 'national team' is purely accidental (ditto Rugby etc) and due to FIFA's ignorance in international football's early development, about the reality of the odd treaty-based nation known as UKofGB&NI. Now that FIFA has twigged that Scotland is not a real nation (ditto England, Wales etc), all bets are off.

Gordon Brown's posturing could be the final nail in the Scottish football team's coffin, and same for any other Scottish 'national' team at any sport. Gordon Brown's British Nationalist policy is only to have GB teams, that is quite evident.

All Scots have to ask themselves if that is what they want (i.e. the demise of any and all Scottish 'national' sporting teams). Or indeed to suffer the ignominy of having national teams represent a non-nation, as is the case today.
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30/05/2009 10:44:30
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30/05/2009 10:49:00
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30/05/2009 10:56:15
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jockstrap,

Cyprus 30/05/2009 10:58:02
The Olympics are a fraud anyway as they are open to professionals nowadays.They should return to the original concept and be all amateur
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30/05/2009 11:06:48
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Buccaneer,

Stirling 30/05/2009 11:09:33
106 - read again. I didn't say Scotland was not a 'real country'. I said that Irish rugby players manage to play alongside Brits without collapsing in a heap, which shows it is possible to be a member of a multi-country team and still be part of an independent nation.

Oh dear. My prejudices are all confirmed!
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30/05/2009 11:13:27
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Gtj,

30/05/2009 11:13:52
doctor death - more like Dr A. Hole
102

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 11:15:50
Personally, I don't see what all the fuss is about. The FAs of Scotland, Wales and NI were given the opportunity to participate if they wanted to. They decided not to as it might jeopardise their status - fair enough. Let's move on - there are many other more important things to be concerned about.
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30/05/2009 11:20:05
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Ugly George,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 11:23:07
106 Darien
What about the Ryder Cup in golf. The European team always consists of players from various countries.
105

morris,

edinburgh 30/05/2009 11:24:09
It still does not address the anomaly of Great Britain are the team which competes in the Olympics which of course by definition excludes Northern Ireland.If we want to be correct here (as opposed to the arrogant nutter posting at 1 2 and 3 )we should rename the team United Kingdom!
It would be better if we simply never endorse anything which dilutes our FA independence,and Scottish fans should demand the resignation of Gordon Union Jock Smith asap.
If England wants to send a team then they should compete as England. We ARE NOT THE SAME COUNTRY and no arrogance will ever make us so!We are whether Unionists
recognise the truth or not A MUTINATIONAL STATE !
England have never got over 1966 and at long last realise it was home advantage which secured the Jules Rimet Trophy. Without home advantage they are not good enough and everybody knows it.
Of course I have since heard that they should NOT have been awarded the trophy since they broke the rules by playing all England fixtures at national stadium Wembley.The rules have changed because the World Cup and Jules Rimet tournament are NOT the same competition,the latter replacing the former.

Of course this is yet another example of Rule Brittania,Britannia waves the rules!
You may not like the truth but it still exists!
I agree with Christine Graham .

GORDON SMITH should be kicked if he does not leave.
This is more than enough reason to force him out.If he wants to work for the British Brainwashing Corporation then fair enough.My licence fee is spent outwith Scotland anyway so even Smith would be an improvement.

Some will take offence at what I have said.I have only one response to you.
What I have said is factually correct! Whats your excuse?
106

Darien,

Panama 30/05/2009 11:24:27
#106 Buc: "I didn't say Scotland was not a 'real country'."

You said, and I quote "..you can be a real country and still play with people born on other spotty lumps of land." If you were refering to Scotland, you are mistaken, because Scotland is not recognised as "a real country" by any other country (i.e. the simple 'country' test).

I daresay Scots in an independent Scotland could still play for a British Lions team if they wish to, just like folks from the independent Ireland do. So you don't have to trade off your nation to play the game, or watch it in your case, do you.

As for prejudices, the fact Scots like you wilfully discard their nation (i.e. for the perceived umbilical chord of a British Nation(alism)) demonstrates an embarrasing level of internal (i.e. Scottish national) prejudice.

In other words, you really can't stand the thought of Scotland being "a real country", can you.

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30/05/2009 11:27:34
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Ugly George,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 11:27:56
116 Dunedin
The situation with rugby is entirely different. There are only a handful of countries where rugby is a major sport and where it is played in front of large crowds.

The last thing the IRB would want to do is reduce this number further. This would reduce the number of meaningful international fixtures and result in a severe loss of revenue from rugby world cups etc.
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30/05/2009 11:32:48
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30/05/2009 11:33:20
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The Scotchman,

30/05/2009 11:34:19
Traitor Smith must be sacked! He has also done nothing in his time there. Another one who will be brought to trial - with no defence - in an independent Scotland.
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Darien,

Panama 30/05/2009 11:35:42
#120 Ugly: "The European team always consists of players from various countries."

Correct. Scots from an independent Scotland would still qualify to play in a European team, if they were good enough. Unless Scotland somehow falls off the European shelf and floats off to the Arctic or somewhere.

I think an issue with the FA's 'deal' is their secret talks on this matter. Hardly transparent, doing deals behind closed doors and all that. Not involving the people, as it were. Not transparent at all. Who do they think they are? The SFA do not represent the Scottish people and hardly represent the Scottish nation (which exists at least in the minds of many Scots who believe in their nation); the SFA represents limited companies (i.f. football businesses).
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morris,

edinburgh 30/05/2009 11:37:58
126 I never thought I would agree with you George.........................but I do for once.

However having said that,it reaffirms what many have known for years about these islands.Decisions depend not upon principle or consequences but upon expediency .
Anybody who tries to run anything upon that basis invites at least controversy if not something far worse and lasting !Northern Ireland springs to mind and Great Britain excludes them!So does this team therefore.
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The Scotchman,

30/05/2009 11:42:01
#106 what are you on about. Didn't know the Union was a deal between two regions. Is someone re-writing this? SNP should investigate to see if the Union has been broken with a fine toothcomb. The "UK" entity may well be illegal as it stands. Fingers crossed.
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jockstrap,

Cyprus 30/05/2009 11:58:59
If England enter a team as Team GB then they should not be allowed to enter any competitions as England. They can't enter under two names.
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Jinselkirk,

30/05/2009 12:10:14
13 if you are going to criticise Christine Grahame you can at least try and spell her surname correctly!
119

JaF,

30/05/2009 12:20:24
There is more to this than just fielding a UK Olympic football team so what could be at stake ?
Since 1946 the four associations have individual seats on FIFA’s rule-making International Football Association Board* and one guaranteed vice-presidency position on FIFA’s Executive Committee.
The four British associations have treasured this special status that Sir Stanley Rous negotiated on their return to the fold in 1946. Plus they are full members of FIFA.

There are 208 members of FIFA with a President and 8 vice Presidents, with one VP position being reserved for a representive from one of the UK football associations.
I am sure the new and/or some of the other members of FIFA will think this arrangement is unfair with each of the four UK football associations having individual votes and being able to appoint a VP from amongst themselves.Plus being able to compete in the World Cup as 4 individual teams from the UK and having a half the members of the IFAB.

*International Football Association Board
IFAB is made up of representatives from each of the United Kingdom's pioneering football associations - The FA, SFA, FAW,IFA plus 4 representatives from FIFA.
Each UK association has one vote and FIFA has four. IFAB deliberations must be approved by at least six votes. Thus, FIFA's approval is necessary for any IFAB decision, but FIFA alone cannot change the Laws of the Game; they need to be agreed by at least two of the UK members.
The IFAB meets twice a year, once to decide on possible changes to the rules governing the game of Football and once to deliberate on its internal affairs.
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The Scotchman,

30/05/2009 12:21:22
As I had read elsewhere, this "Team GB" or "Great Britain Team at the Olympics" does not exist!

There is no such country as Great Britain. Very important - that is not the name of the sovereign state! Great Britain is nothing but an island. This is not 1707 and Kingdom of Great Britain does not exist. So why is "Great Britain" in the Olympics? Don't argue. "Great Britain", by that name, is in the Olympics, but "Great Britain" is nothing!

Do we see the island of Borneo in the Olympics? Didn't think so! This participation of some fabricated "Great Britain" country must be illegal. SNP must fully investigate. This must be further evidence that the Union has been broken and that as such, at this very moment in time, England and Scotland are fully independent.
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Maryann,

30/05/2009 12:22:15
Why on earth is football included in the Olympics any way . There are so many championships and international competitions already. It could not matter less. The Olymics is quite daft and grossly swollen out of all proportion with tennis, football, beach volleyball! and a host of pointless sports. It should revert to what it was originally, namely track and field.
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30/05/2009 12:27:02
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DougtheDug,

30/05/2009 12:27:43
I think that the SFA even letting a GB side compete is dangerous. A precedent has been set, that a single home nation can represent the whole of the UK in an international competition.

I suspect the next ruling from FIFA will be that only a GB side can play in international football competitions. How the home nations choose the team, a full GB side, a single home nation chosen via playoffs or a lottery will be an internal UK matter and not up to FIFA.

The English FA don't care about the threat from FIFA even though the existence of the English FA is as threatened as the SFA, FAW and the IFA because they see it as an expansion and believe they will survive as the "natural" British FA while the SFA, FAW and IFA disappear. For them it's an enlargement not a threat. OK, they'll have a name change and a new strip but realistically speaking nothing else will change for them.

The BOA are the most parochial bunch of all and would happily see the end of the FA, SFA, FAW and IFA and the international status of the home teams as long as they get their London under-23 compeition played in 2012

I also keep seeing the British and Irish Lions as an example of why a GB team is quite feasible but the Lions play as a touring side not as an international side and they don't represent a nation in any international tournaments.

Everyone else plays to, "One passport, one team", in football and I can't see the home nations lasting much longer as individual sides.

It's an easy solution. We get our own Scottish Passports.
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JaF,

30/05/2009 12:36:56
#114 - # 112 dundedin bully wee is correct.
1.George Peat, SFA president said he was privately advised by Fifa president Sepp Blatter that the involvement in the London Olympics would jeopardise Scotland's separate status. BBC 3 Mar 2009
2.Jack Warner, head of the Trinidad and Tobago FA and a current Fifa vice-president, is among those opposed to the unique position of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland in fielding national teams despite not being independent countries.18th Dec 2008
3.David Will Scotland's former Fifa vice-president who has been on the Fifa executive committee for almost two decades has also warned against taking part. 16 Dec 2008
4.Michel Platini, Uefa president has said he understands the three home nations' opposition. 16 Dec 2008
5..David Taylor , UEFA big gun last night warned the SFA not to trust FIFA's claims that our national side would be safe if a British team competed at the 2012 Olympics.Nov 13 2008
6. Craig Brown former Scottish football manager, "I don’t trust Fifa". He fears FIFA will ultimately use any such team to force the four home nations to enter just one side in ALL competitions.12 Dec 2008
7.Sepp Blatter the president of FIFA has again threatened the four British football associations if they try to field a combined team at the 2012 Olympics. The threat is simple-field a combined team and lose your individual associations.March 09, 2008
P.S. Ten years ago, there was a formal Caribbean motion to end Wales’ existence as a World Cup team by forcing them to play under one Great Britain banner.The move only received three votes at a Fifa congress, but Wales have always feared since it would raise its head again one day. Jul 26 2008


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30/05/2009 12:42:06
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Calum Crubag,

30/05/2009 12:49:28
Aye, stop Team GB. What a horrible idea. Let the English stand on their own two feet for a change. They don't rule the waves any more.
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Media at One,

30/05/2009 13:19:57
The Tartan T0$$ers are angry - awe diddums!
A Great Britain team at the olympics is perfectly acceptable and since Scotland is part of the union and a very proud part at that, it's the SFA's duty to standby and support the cause.
There will ofcourse be those who are against such a move, but we need to ignore their narrow minded and illbread approach.
Scotland has it's own football team, always will. FIFA DO NOT own football, so an independent Scotland is safe and Blatter knows that trying to take on the Football Associations of Scotland, England, N.Ireland and Wales would be suicide. Besides, he doesnt have the law on his side to do so anyway.
Most Scots will get behind team GB because most of us are above bigotted anti English nonsense, we can identify that Scotland and Scots are able to stand along side our friends in England, N.Ireland and Wales for one common cause.
If the argument that there are not enough Scots in the team surfaces, then the true Scot responds by embracing reality - we simply are not good enough at the moment and as a result are not turning out the class we should be. But let's get behind Darren Fletcher and team GB -
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30/05/2009 13:23:30
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Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 13:26:11
re142

They only waive the rules! Or change them to suit and imptove the cash return!

re130

Doing secret deals behind closed doors - The Labour GB way of doing things!
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30/05/2009 13:31:03
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Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 13:33:02
Plenty of Disingenuity from the little Britishers today! Grubby Broonie would be pwoud of you. Not even Fergusson that gweat bwitisher would touch tweam Gwubby Bwown with a barge pole!
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Media at One,

30/05/2009 13:42:32
Scotland the Brave - Britain the place we belong!
I must be honest I am absolutely thrilled at being British. I love Britain - Scotland, N.Ireland, Wales and England are all amazing places with awesome people and fine traditions. All four nations are unique and all of them are truly spectacular, but united under the Union Jack they become ONE ABSOLUTELY STUNNING partnership.
Team GB will do the business, cmon lads!Get intae thaim.
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mr broon,

Edinburgh 30/05/2009 14:00:15
It is laughable how this debate has degenerated into an argument between Nationalists and Little Englanders and Scotlanders .

All of them appear highly anxious about their heritage and beliefs and taunt one another with ridiculous facts?

Somehow or another the Royal Navy crept into the debate and continually looking backwards to an Empire that no longer exists!

Nationalist and Unionist posters should log onto the US Department of Defense website and they will find that Washington spends MORE each year on the US National Guard, Air National Guard, and US Naval Reserve (the equivalent of the UK Territorial Army, RAF, and Royal Naval Reserve) than the ANNUAL UK Defence Budget!

The US Naval Reserve has more surface ships than the Royal Navy! The US National Guard has over 500,000 armed reservists, greater than the total numbers serving in the British Army! The US Air National Guard has 110,0000 personnel flying a squadron of fighter and bomber aircraft from every one of the 50 States!

Its time all these childish Nationalists and Unionists realised that the world now has only
one conventional and nuclear super power:
the United States of America.
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Fred Leeson,

edinburgh 30/05/2009 14:01:27
#143 / 148 Meeja
"Most Scots will get behind team GB"
Ha ha . Can you give me the name of the stuff you're smoking ? It's mighty powerful.
Jim Murphy and his Unionist mates will back them and that's about it.
Imagine the abuse Scotland would get if we tried to pass ourselves off as Team GB. From inside and outside of Scotland. Not that we'd want to.
Oh and by the way in case you didn't know it Northern Ireland isn't in Britain.
We are the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

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Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 14:10:23
re149

So whats your point exactly in relation to Football?

Or perhaps you would prefer the USA to become part of a team North America and that Canada be deprived of its Independent Football status bcause its teams happen to compete in a North American league?

More disingenuity from a troll I fear!
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Media at One,

30/05/2009 14:15:15
Fred Leeson

Away n get yer dole money!

Scotland is part of Britain and if a team GB is playing the true Scots will get behind the team in the same manner that the true Scots get behind the British and Irish Lions - You can always tell a true Scot from a poor minded English hating Scot.
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Media at One,

30/05/2009 14:17:13
lainbroch

Why would Canada lose its status by joining the states in a North American team?
Who will stop them? FIFA - DONT MAKE ME LAUGH
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Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 14:33:16
re 153

Floats over Unionist heads everytime! The arguements you present here and on other forums if followed to thier logical conclusion are arguements for Canada to be swallowed up by USA and for other Nations to be swallowed up by larger neighbours! You really dont get it do you?
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Iainbroch,

30/05/2009 14:41:05
Bye all! Falkirk for the Cup - Did I just say that? Oh dear Something Grahamski and I can agree on - oh Jeepers! Funny old world is it not?
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JaF,

30/05/2009 14:49:13
#143 Scotland has it's own football team, always will. FIFA DO NOT own football....

Concerns outside the UK about the privileged position England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have on the eight-man International FA Board.
..........and nations from Africa and the Caribbean want to break the historical voting right the four home countries have held since time immemorial.
Ten years ago, there was a formal Caribbean motion to end Wales’ existence as a World Cup team by forcing them to play under one Great Britain banner.
The move only received three votes at a Fifa congress, but Wales have always feared since it would raise its head again one day.
The Olympic ideology being pushed forward by the powers-that-be, they argue, could be just the excuse the Caribbean and African nations need.
http://tinyurl.com/5tx6oj Jul 26 2008 WalesOnline

"There are a fair number of people within Fifa, principally in the Concacaf Association, who would like to see Britain no longer have four associations and four separate teams," BBC 29 May 2009

Jack Warner, head of the Trinidad and Tobago FA and a current Fifa vice-president, is among those opposed to the unique position of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland in fielding national teams despite not being independent countries.18th Dec 2008
BTW:One day Jack Warner could become President of FIFA.

The 207 members each have one vote and effectively decide on how soccer is run by voting on issues at the FIFA congress.
141

Media at One,

30/05/2009 14:49:44
lainbroch
The babble you dispense would be laughable if it wasn’t so grave. You will ambush any issue with your stomach turning nationalist claptrap and continue to embarrass decent Scottish people the world over on the basis that you were brought up on odium for England. I really don’t care that you suffer from a serious bout of intolerance brought on by years of indoctrination bestowed upon you by adults who would be out of their intellectual depth along side under educated children.
Scotland as it stands is part of the union and with that in mind we qualify to be part of the Olympics under the Union flag – Encase you didn’t know, all the blue parts of the union flag represent our great nation and I for one salute that.
So unless you can come up with a better reason for boycotting the Olympics you lose. And please don’t use the FIFA will take away our independent status nonsense, that wont wash.
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Media at One,

30/05/2009 14:52:53
JaF

I hear you, but that would never happen - FIFA would need to distance itself from the English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish Football Associations to cater for who? Some back water African mob looking for handouts?
Aye right, I can see that happening! FIFA would be left with the Carribean and Oceanic football and some new governing body would come in and take over the rest. Dont be fooled into the false belief that FIFA has the power, they dont!
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European Scot,

30/05/2009 15:34:14
The independent status of Scotland in international football is paramount, and nothing should ever be accepted which might threaten that.
Blatter made it quite clear that accepting a GB presence in the Olympics would pose a threat to the status of the individual 'home' countries.
What is interesting is looking at those posters above who have shown, with their various arguments, how very keen they are to defend the 'Team GB' idea.
Not surprisingly, the bulk of them appear to be Unionists.
It's doubtful if many people in Europe would notice any difference between 'Team GB' and an all English version, the two are indeed synonymous.
It's no accident that this is the case, and that Scotland is just viewed as a region of the 'UK'. That's exactly how Gordon Brown, and his beloved Establishment like it.
All the more reason to continue on the road to full independence, by keeping an ever watchful eye on all those who would thwart that endeavour. They will try to do so by whatever means, and in whatever area of life they can exert their 'British' influence.
The name of the game isn't just football, it's about turning us all into happy little 'Brits', whilst continuing the process of trying to dilute Scottish identity even further.
A most definite, and deafening condemnation of this one.
Perhaps Scotland football supporters will be helping to increase the SNP presence in Europe next week.
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Media at One,

30/05/2009 15:45:25
European Scot

Erm - Here is the thing ya nutter!
If the independence of Scottish Football is under threat then taking part in the Olympics makes no difference.
It cant just be under threat because of a possible Olympic team, it must be under threat already! So taking part in the olympics changes nothing that already is.
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Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 15:58:45
1,2, 3 a North Brit writes
146

Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 16:00:52
The fact that this non-story is confined to the middle pages rather than the sporting pages shows how much importance the fitba community attaches to this two-bit competition.
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Don Roberto,

30/05/2009 16:00:58
I'm disappointed, the forcing through of a Team GB was the sure fire route to independence, with all the 90 minute patriots up in arms.
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30/05/2009 16:00:59
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Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 16:02:22
143 - correction; FIFA DO own fitba.
150

European Scot,

30/05/2009 16:02:40
163 Media at One

Well thank you for the suggestion of being a nutter, but I suspect with your presence here, I would hopefully be considered comparatively sane and reasonable !
I don't know exactly who, or what you think you represent on here, but one thing is for sure, you do not in any way represent Scotland, or its best interests.
Submerging a Scottish identity under a British one, will never promote the message to the rest of the World, that Scotland is a country, and a Nation, in its own right.
You may be happy to keep Scotland contained within your own little introverted image of a' Team GB' at the Olympics, keeping it as a region of your all glorious 'United Kingdom', but many more of us have higher, and much more outward looking ambitions,
That would be Scotland as a Country, and Nation, raising its international profile, doing business and making direct cultural contacts with the rest of the World.
Time to move forward, but that will entail people like you turning your head around, instead of forever looking backwards at days of Empire, thankfully long since dead.
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Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 16:05:53
146 "Team GB we support you" - supporters' meetings held in phone boxes all over the country
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European Scot,

30/05/2009 16:13:50
167 dunedin bully wee

" Fortunately, these people are being removed from all positions of influence at every level of Scottish society, and the Euro elections will merely hasten this process."

I sincerely hope that Scots from every different political colour will get together and put Scotland's interests ahead of those of past individual political allegiances.
Support for the SNP at the Euro Elections would send a strong message.
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30/05/2009 16:15:45
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Iain Mac,

30/05/2009 16:59:01
No Team GB. Though, going ahead with it could be another nail in the union's coffin.

The very idea of GB and indeed, it's history, is abhorrent and seems to be based on greed, imperialism and racism. Scotland should get back to the pre-Union days when we traded on friendly terms with our European neighbours instead of warring with them. One look at Europe sees lots of small nations with their own voices. Why would Norway want to be ruled by Denmark again. Equally, how many Irish want to be ruled from London? Are the Estonians and Finnish seeking to be ruled from Moscow again?

No. Let's go it alone and leave England to their warmongering and xenophobia.
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Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 16:59:46
172 they probably will. You know, there's got tae be some kind of token gesture. I doubt that it'll be a full stadium or anythin like it.

Nae doobt there'll be a secret meeting to arrange it.
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Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 17:22:00
100 what gets the bigger attendances ? fitba or rugby ?
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Pilrig,

Livingston 30/05/2009 17:26:33
I have to laugh at the pro- Team GB XI argument. If rugby, athletics, golf etc. can combine why not 'soccer' ?
They really don't get it !
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30/05/2009 19:02:46
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30/05/2009 19:17:28
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30/05/2009 20:09:52
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FTH22inarow,

30/05/2009 23:05:57
ITS AN ENGLISH OLYIMPICS, HOPEFULLY WE WILL BE INDEPENDENT BY THEN, AND THE GFA CAN GTF.
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hoblar,

31/05/2009 00:04:12
This decision wasn't made in the interests of the people of England, though by default they will make up the team members to preserve the embarrassment of a british Government that couldn't make up a 'team GB' football team that actually had the ingredients required, i.e. representatives from Scotland Wales and Northern Ireland.

Even when a constituent country was hosting the olympics, they had to have this effort of a kak compromise, and watching the unionist dodos 'explaining' this pile of nonsense, (making big efforts dozens of time on here to do so), is a really brilliant laugh indeed to be honest.

hardy har har har.

Team Gb, ]a joke that will be laughed at for all the WRONG reasons, (England will certainly provide a great competitive football team, of that I have no doubt) but the fact that it is only England players will be known and the reasons understood throughout the world!

Dear oh dear.
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Pilrig,

Livingston 31/05/2009 08:52:06
178 - presumably you wont be watching Team GB on the box if it's scorching day too ?
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yoric,

31/05/2009 11:09:30
The bloggers here miss the obvious, Brown is not anti Scottish but anti English.
The team should of course be called team England, but Brown can't say England.
Can anyone remember the last time in ANY speech he used the word England.
165

Number 6,

Germany 31/05/2009 11:25:27
If it were me, I would have gone ahead straight away when the other home nations declined to participate.

I would have picked a squad from the "Championship". That way, they would get players ready to play for the shirt with passion.

It's not unusal for one country to produce all the players for a team squad. England in hockey for example. Scotland have also produced all the players for the GB curling squad in the past.

It would have helped if England had not refused point blank to take part in a proposed British Cup competition.

Providing the SFA have got cast iron assurances from FIFA that this will not affect our status as an independent team, then I have no problem with this decision.

If no assurances have been given, then that's another kettle of fish altogether.
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Andy Ritchie's left boot,

01/06/2009 10:03:51
**** The SNP claimed that "fans across the country would be cheering the move". *****

an SNP spokesman siad that? Or did the Scotsman just make that up? Well here's one fan, and an SNP member at that, who isn't cheering the move.

If England want to enter a team then let them, and the best of luck to them. However they should call the team "England". A team of Englishmen can never represent Scotland in whole or in part.

Gordon Smith, hang your unionist head in shame.
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GOODBYE LONDON LABOUR,

Aberdeen 01/06/2009 21:36:45
These Brit-Nats make me puke. Who gives a t@ss about Engerlund and the Butcher's Apron? Gordon Brown's pathetic attempt at sporting 'Britishness' is typical of a London Labour Quisling Scot and is doomed to failure. Pity Gordon Smith has not taken a firmer line.
168

Charley,

US of A 01/06/2009 22:50:38
Man, the weed, sorry, flower of Sotchland never stops whinging....you guys are like the twisted old men of that damp island. A view from across the sea - pathetic wee, little damp, cold, grey, fattie, place...lighten up.
169

Charley,

Estados Unidos 01/06/2009 23:05:56
och aye the noo...hoots man I lost me heed. Um, you'll never take me freedom...well, for some gold and a bit a land I will...flower of scotchland, tartan pants, we gave the world gratvity and the sun, um, I'm scoootish no english pal, rabbie 'wa thay hootd is he saying', 'doonee know lets look like weese knows', um, haggis and buckfast..I love scotchland. As I reach 35,000 feet heading west.
170

Findlay Thompson,

Cowdenbeath 02/06/2009 08:58:29
188.

How are the girls doing Chuck? Give me an update anytime.

 

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