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Lobbe adamant Argentina should compete in the Six Nations



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Published Date: 17 June 2008
THERE were signs even when the anthems were playing of just how much Saturday's second Test meant to Argentina's Juan Fernandez Lobbe.
The popular Sale flanker lost himself in emotion as the Argentine song played out, gripping his brother Ignacio in the line-up, tears cascading down his face. He could not let his brother go when the squad broke up to prepare for the kick-off, and th
e thought of playing his last Test with Ignacio before he retired was clearly at the forefront of his mind.

During the game, too, he twice had to be warned to calm down, once handing Scotland a penalty by grappling with Chris Paterson off the ball.

There is no doubting Fernandez Lobbe's passion for Argentine rugby, and he says there is nothing he would like more now than to see the Pumas welcomed more significantly into the world rugby firmament. And he particularly craves an invite to the Six Nations Championship.

"It's much easier to develop and perform well if you play ten or 11 games a year than playing three or six games," he said. "We are playing three games now in June and we don't even have all our players available for selection because they are in France and when they do come back later in the year, the coaches have just three games with everyone together.

"We play Italy later this month and then nothing for six months, so it will be difficult to stay in third in the world.

"That's why Argentina teams have all the heart, the passion and attitude and all that. It's because we know that we only have a few games, so we say let's put everything into that.

What I would like to see now for Argentine rugby is the IRB to give us a place with the other nations. I know people say we should be in the Tri Nations because we are in the southern hemisphere, but we are still a long, long way from New Zealand, Australia and South Africa.

"We are closer to Europe in many ways. For me, it would be better to join the Six Nations because 95 per cent of our players are playing in Europe."





The full article contains 379 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 16 June 2008 11:51 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

The Laird of Kitakyushu,

17/06/2008 07:25:08
Until domestic rugby in Argentina goes professional at the top level the IRB seems unlikely to look favourably on an Argentinian bid for the Rugby World Cup, and perhaps will also not be overly willing to let them join either the Six Nations or the Tri-Nations.

However, according to their own propaganda (Total Rugby) the IRB is giving quite a lot of money to Argentina, presumably with a view to making the game there professional.
2

Big Red,

Aberdeen 17/06/2008 07:48:49

It's nothing to do with the domestic set up in Argentinian rugby, and everything to do with the money (or lack of it) that Argentinian TV can bring to the table.

It's a disgrace that the 3rd ranked country in world rugby hasn't been invited to participate in either the northern or more sensibly, the southern hemisphere's premier tournaments.

I suspect that it actually shows complete snobbery on the part of SA, Australia and NZ that they haven't invited Argentina to compete.

Argentinian rugby is on a high just now, but they need to increase the profile to keep the interest srong and to keep on bringing younger players through, and being part of one of the major tournaments is the way to do this.


I for one would welcome them into a revised '7 nations'...they'd be a fantastic addition, and I quite fancy a trip to Buenos Aires (or more likely Barcelona or Madrid ) !
3

thebigiam,

17/06/2008 08:16:05
There is a lot of sense in letting them join a revamped 7N. Many of their players are based in Europe. And I think it would make the format fairer, with equal home and away games for each nation. I suspect it would also help to raise the standards as well.
4

The Laird of Kitakyushu,

17/06/2008 09:02:09
#2 Do you think Argentinian TV would bring more or less money to the table if Argentinian domestic rugby were professional?

I dare say anyway that there are plenty of top clubs in Argentina (e.g. CUBA) which will resist professionalism until their dying breath. That is their choice, but in that case Argentina will most likely not be allowed by the IRB to host the RWC any time soon. As for whether it will nevertheless be allowed to join either of the top competitions, 6N or Tri-Nations, I don't know. It's a separate question really.
5

John not from the Borders,

Haddington 17/06/2008 09:17:37
Joining the 6N isn't really an option as it would add to an already congested season just when things are getting straightened out. I would suspect that the French and English clubs in particular would be strongly against it.

Do we extend an already long season or do the league fixtures continue, without the international players, thereby disadvantaging certain clubs over others and devaluing the game.

Just because their professional players play for European clubs doesn’t mean that the 6Ns is the tournament that they should join.
6

ExpatNI,

17/06/2008 09:19:45
Agree wholeheartedly that Argentina should be invited to join a '7'Nations tournament. Only problem is that Scotland would likely end up 7th instead of 6th! Agree also, it would be great if their 'home' games were in Barcelona or Madrid.
7

Stu,

Edinburgh 17/06/2008 09:26:51
Until they go pro they cant be invited in. You cant have your cake and eat it.
8

A Pale Merk,

17/06/2008 09:49:42
#7 - What a load of nonsense.

What point are you trying to make?

That a country which has followed a sensible business model and in the process reached third rank in the world should not be allowed to continue like that?

That they should be more like us, and go down a route which has knackered our finances and killed the infrastructure of the game in this country?

Just because we have got it horribly wrong doesn't mean we should bully other countries into following our lead.

The Argentinean domestic structure works for them and to force them into a highly expensive and dangerous change in policy is irresponsible.

If it aint broke don't fix it - and the only thing which is hindering Argentinean rugby is the intransigence of the IRB (and more accurately 'Big Eight')!

This isn't a case of them having their cake and eating it. This is a case of them being force fed our rotten, stale cake.
9

blueberry,

exile 17/06/2008 09:52:48
If anyone had any long-term vision, letting Argentina play in the 7N based in Spain would be rejected as nonsense. Argentina in a European competition just because their best players are based in Europe? I can't stand all this farting about for short-term convenience.

I'm with Stu on this one. The Pumas shouldn't be given a free ride by European pro-rugby when they are in a position to help themselves to some considerable extent. The best long-term solution would be to back domestic pro-rugby throughout the Americas. Professionalism is an ambition of the US and Canadian rugby unions as well as a possibility in Argentina. There would be a lot of work to do to get there, but three domestic leagues supporting Pan-American versions of the HC and 3N is a much better proposition than squeezing extra nations one by one into the 6N and 3N. It would give their international sides regular matches, supplemented by June tests against other nations.

If I were Spanish I would be well hacked off at how easily people in other countries were offering to supplant the national side with the Pumas. People may snort in derision at the suggestion that the Spanish (and other European nations) might want to follow Italy's footsteps in developing credible domestic and international rugby, but they do. The president of the Spanish RU has declared their ambition to develop an Iberian pro-league, partly to help the development of the Spanish and Portuguese national sides. Basing the Pumas in Barcelona or Madrid would detract from that effort.
10

blueberry,

exile 17/06/2008 10:22:36
#8 "If it ain't broke don't fix it"!? At the moment there are about a dozen countries around the world capable of fielding anything like a competitive side. That number is never seriously going to go up unless the structure supporting them grows. So if you're happy with world cups at which only half a dozen teams are ever going to be likely to win; the same "big eight" dominating; new nations like Italy and Argentina emerging at a rate of about 1 every 30 years, fine.

Personally I'd rather see a bigger, more competitive global game, and that's not going to happen without more opportunities for rugby players to take on the game professionally, and in places other than the GP, T14 and S14.

Argentina have only been able to build a credible side because their top players have the opportunity to play professionally in Europe. The GP and T14 now support to a considerable extent the player pools for Argentina, the pacific nations, Romania, Georgia, Canada, etc, as well as significant numbers of players for nations that have their own pro sides.

We are at saturation point with the current set-up. There is no real extra capacity for other nations to follow the Argentinean model of building a competitive side of players training in other countries. If Argentina had domestic pro rugby their own international player pool would grow and there would be opportunities in those teams for players from other countries to reach higher standards. Uruguay, Paraguay, Chile, Brazil and the like could benefit enormously.

Just because we’ve made a mess of professionalism in Scotland doesn’t mean that everyone will follow us down the toilet if they try it themselves. I’d back just about anyone to make a better fist of it than we did.

11

The Laird of Kitakyushu,

17/06/2008 12:46:36
#9 I quite agree that if I were a proud Spaniard I would not take kindly to Argentina muscling in on the 6N and then expecting use of Madrid stadia etc. into the bargain! That would merely exacerbate the 'cuckoo-in-the-nest' situation which we have already to a degree.
12

La barrière de Senlis,

France 17/06/2008 12:53:32
Argentina not be included in the 6N

Too much congestion in the European Rugby.
The clubs are interested with the Argentinians, because they are free most of the season.
13

J.A.,

17/06/2008 13:43:48
I think there is a fear of Argentina, particularly from the three big southern hemisphere nations. They are happy with their domination without allowing any smaller nations like Argentina, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa and Japan join the party. I think it is a disgrace to be thinking about Argentina joining the 6 nations in opposed to the tri nations. The European nations have brought in Italy and could in the future bring teams like Spain and Rumania into the fold if their standards rise.
The question is, do we want the game to grow or are the bigger nations happier seeing themselves as a big fish in a small pond?
14

chief brody,

manchester, england 17/06/2008 15:36:02
i agree that the Pumas have earnt their place at one of the big international competitions. i do think that it makes more sense for them to play in the 6/7 nations as the majority of their players are based in europe and i also think that far from hindering the development of spanish rugby it would actually assist it.

i do however think that the fixture list in the northern hemisphere is already too crowded and adding another match to the 6 nations would only make things worse. so how about the creation of a world series, the top 10 or 12 international teams split in to 2 groups with each team playing the others in their group and matches taking place across the current international windows (Summer, autumn and feb/march)at the end of the group stage the top team in one group playing the second team in the other , the winners play the final. something like that might be the best step to developing a worldd rugby season and lessening the demands on top players.
15

J.A.,

17/06/2008 16:29:32
Is allowing the Argentineans to add to the 6 nations going to improve their rugby or is it simply going to make it appear even more distant?
Surely, top Argentinean players should be encouraged to play in a pro set up in their own country where their public can watch regular home internationals. I agree with #9 that pro rugby should be encouraged in the American continent.
16

The Laird of Kitakyushu,

17/06/2008 22:26:31
#15 I think the IRB is trying to encourage pro rugby in the Americas, as part of a scheme to "develop the game" as they would put it.

One thing Lobbe says in the article is rather funny. Argentina is in fact a lot closer to South Africa geographically than New Zealand is. (This rather blows the theory that the other SH nations are too far away to join them out of the water doesn't it?)
17

Venachar,

18/06/2008 10:47:42
Develop rugby in the Americas!!

Watch the Churchill Cup this weekend on Sky. Argentina should either play in the Tri-nations or develop in America.

The next world cup has started out there (caribbean) already I think.

 

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